The short version
At a glance
In the third episode of Down To A Science, Kevin G. Libuit talks with Dr. Tshaka Cunningham, a molecular biologist, biotech entrepreneur, and educator. Dr. C learned PCR in his grandmother’s cancer research lab at seven, but he didn’t picture a PhD for himself until he met a Black male scientist at 17. He describes learning drug discovery at Bristol Myers Squibb, working across academia, government, and industry, and building molecular tools for behavioral health at Polaris Genomics. The conversation then turns to LIFT-VA, a Virginia program that trains students and instructors for life sciences jobs, and to his advice on AI: use the tools, but stay above the AI layer.
Dr. Tshaka Cunningham co-founded Polaris Genomics, where he is Director of Research & Development, and is Chief Scientific Officer at Athari BioSciences. After studying molecular biology at Princeton, he worked in drug discovery at Bristol Myers Squibb. He then earned his PhD at Rockefeller University, completed postdoctoral training at NIH and the Pasteur Institute in Paris, and later oversaw a large neurodegenerative disease research program at VA headquarters.
Ideas to take with you
Six key takeaways
Early exposure changes what feels possible.
Dr. C built real lab skills as a child in his grandmother’s cancer research lab. He wants every student to get some version of that experience.
02:16 ↗Representation makes a path visible.
Even with that head start, he didn’t see a PhD as his path until he met a Black male scientist in a Morehouse School of Medicine summer program at 17.
10:09 ↗Drug discovery is a long funnel.
It starts with understanding how a disease works. Thousands of candidates narrow to one or two that reach human studies, and he says about half of those fail.
25:37 ↗Basic research feeds future cures.
Dr. C argues that research into how organisms work needs steady funding, because drug developers depend on that understanding.
33:08 ↗Teach teamwork and communication, too.
LIFT-VA capstones ask small teams to pitch and defend a solution, the way young scientists pitch ideas inside a company.
53:37 ↗Stay above the AI layer.
He uses AI tools to work faster but keeps the original idea his own, and he tells students to be the creative force behind the work.
59:15 ↗
Find your thread
Episode chapters
Chapter times match the published YouTube episode. Each time opens that point on YouTube.
- 00:00 ↗
The human spark behind scientific creativity
A preview of Dr. C’s point that a person’s lived experience is the part a computer can’t supply.
- 00:34 ↗
Meet Dr. Tshaka Cunningham
Kevin introduces Dr. C, his roles at Polaris Genomics and Athari BioSciences, and his work with Future Kings, GEMS, and LIFT-VA.
- 02:16 ↗
A childhood in his grandmother’s lab
Summers in a cancer research lab, learning PCR at seven and practicing pipetting with food coloring.
- 06:35 ↗
Three generations of science, art, and service
Hard science from his grandmother, creativity from his mother, and a commitment to community from his great-grandmother.
- 10:09 ↗
Finding a path through curiosity and representation
Endless questions, easy biology grades, and meeting a Black male PhD for the first time at 17.
- 14:11 ↗
Mentorship and Black pioneers in science
Charles Drew, E. E. Just, and why Dr. C saw science as a place where good ideas could carry.
- 19:44 ↗
Choosing a scientific career
High school teachers, Princeton, and shadowing an MD-PhD before choosing the lab over the clinic.
- 24:20 ↗
Learning drug discovery at Bristol Myers Squibb
A hundred resumes, two job offers, and nearly four years as an associate research scientist.
- 25:37 ↗
How an idea becomes a medicine
From disease mechanism to screening assays, animal studies, and the long funnel to human trials.
- 29:50 ↗
From Rockefeller to government science
PhD mentors Charles M. Rice and David Ho, postdocs at NIH and the Pasteur Institute, and a move into program management.
- 33:08 ↗
Connecting academia, industry, and government
Why basic research needs steady funding, and why Dr. C wants science kept out of politics.
- 38:19 ↗
From federal service to biotech entrepreneurship
A year learning regulatory affairs at DIA, then co-founding a biotech company.
- 41:56 ↗
Molecular diagnostics for behavioral health
Building a gene panel to study conditions such as PTSD and depression at the molecular level.
- 44:50 ↗
Building the biotech workforce through LIFT-VA
How Future Kings, GEMS, and Athari BioSciences came together to train students for Virginia’s life sciences jobs.
- 49:09 ↗
Industry partnerships and training future leaders
Industry partners for the program’s data science track, and a cohort of master’s and PhD instructors.
- 51:38 ↗
Expanding early-career scientists’ options
Kevin’s own path from pre-med to public health, and the careers students rarely hear about.
- 53:37 ↗
Teamwork, capstones, and communicating science
Student teams pitch and defend a solution to a health problem, much like a pitch inside a company.
- 56:00 ↗
Preparing scientists for AI
A planned course on generative AI in drug discovery, and why Dr. C wants AI regulated carefully.
- 59:15 ↗
Creativity and staying above the AI layer
Using AI tools for speed while keeping the original idea human.
- 1:03:53 ↗
AI’s potential in drug discovery
Designing a molecule with AI, and what that could mean for the scientists around him.
- 1:05:45 ↗
Closing reflections on service
A saying from his great-grandmother: service is the rent we pay for living.
The longer read
In-depth summary
A childhood in his grandmother’s lab
Dr. C’s grandmother was a cancer researcher at the National Cancer Institute, and at Walter Reed before that. Born during segregation in the 1930s, she couldn’t pursue a PhD, though he says she trained people who went on to lead major organizations. He compares her to the women of Hidden Figures. When he was seven, she started bringing him to her small cell lung cancer lab at a Navy medical research hospital across the street from NIH in Bethesda. That was his summer camp. He learned PCR there and practiced pipetting food coloring onto parafilm, from one microliter up to a milliliter. He still teaches students the same way.
He credits three women for the rest. His grandmother gave him the hard science. His mother, a fine arts graduate of Howard University, gave him a corner of her studio to make things, and he says that creative habit still helps him think outside the box. His great-grandmother took in neighborhood children who needed care and taught him that it isn’t just about you. You have to help the people around you.
Curiosity, representation, and Black pioneers in science
Biology came easily, but a science career didn’t feel obvious. Dr. C says he didn’t meet a Black male PhD until he was 17, in a summer research program at Morehouse School of Medicine named for the biologist Ernest Everett Just. Working on prostate cancer there with a Black scientist as his mentor made the career feel real. It also shaped his choice of Princeton, where he studied molecular biology and worked with Arnold Levine, whose lab discovered p53 in 1979.
He found heroes in history, too. Charles Drew developed ways to store blood that made large-scale blood banking possible. E. E. Just studied fertilization in marine eggs but was shut out of positions his white peers could get. Science appealed to Dr. C because a good idea can carry past prejudice. Nearly a century after Just, he earned his own PhD at Rockefeller University.
Choosing the lab over the clinic
Dr. C finished Princeton as a pre-med student with options, but he still didn’t understand the difference between an MD career and a PhD career. Shadowing Cato T. Laurencin, an MD-PhD orthopaedic surgeon who also ran bone regeneration research, settled it. He liked the lab and the questions, not the operating room.
Instead of going straight to graduate school, he sent about a hundred resumes to drug companies, got three interviews and two offers, and joined Bristol Myers Squibb as an associate research scientist in drug discovery. He calls those nearly four years almost a PhD in industry. When he started his doctorate at Rockefeller, he knew what he wanted to work on and finished in five years.
How an idea becomes a medicine
Modern drug discovery starts with mechanism. Researchers work out how a disease happens and which molecules drive it, then choose a target to change. Statins, which lower cholesterol, are his example. Chemists design molecules that bind the target with the intended effect and, ideally, few side effects. That is hard, he says, because one molecule is supposed to do one thing in a body full of other targets.
At Bristol Myers Squibb his work sat in the middle of that process. He read academic papers for promising pathways, built screening assays to find compounds that bind a target, and tested the hits in cells and then in small animals. Candidates that hold up move to larger animals and eventually people. He describes it as a funnel: thousands of opportunities narrow to one or two candidates in human studies, and about half of those fail.
Academia, government, and industry
At Rockefeller, Dr. C’s mentors included Charles M. Rice, who shared the 2020 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine for the discovery of hepatitis C virus, and David Ho, whose lab led early work on combination antiretroviral therapy for HIV. Academia was seductive, he says, but after postdocs at NIH and the Pasteur Institute he felt pulled elsewhere. A Myers-Briggs assessment (ENTP, or in his words an extroverted nerd) pointed him toward science program management. He took a program management job in government and enjoyed using both his science and his people skills.
Having worked in all three sectors, he argues that each one needs the others. Basic research builds the understanding of mechanism that drug development depends on, so he would add funding rather than cut it. He points to the decades of work behind today’s hepatitis C cures, says science should stay apolitical, and cites Rockefeller University’s motto: science for the benefit of humanity.
From federal service to Polaris Genomics
Dr. C served in the federal government across the Bush, Obama, and early Trump administrations. When he left, he spent a year as director of scientific collaboration at the Drug Information Association to learn regulatory affairs, a gap in his experience. He came away convinced that regulation matters as much as discovery. If approval is too slow or too onerous, he says, companies stop trying.
He then advised and co-founded Polaris Genomics. Mental health diagnosis relies mostly on self-reported surveys, and many conditions share symptoms, so he asks what major depression or PTSD looks like at the molecular level. Starting from licensed biomarkers, he built a panel of about a thousand markers as a discovery space. The team found and patented new markers and built an algorithm that, he says, is now in a pivotal clinical study as the company works toward the FDA. He had to learn neuroscience along the way, and he hopes the panel will be useful beyond PTSD. He is also Chief Scientific Officer at Athari BioSciences, which he describes as closer to his roots in cancer and infectious disease.
Building Virginia’s biotech workforce
Dr. C wants every student to get some version of the exposure he had. That work started with Future Kings, a Northern Virginia nonprofit that trains young men from underserved communities in STEM. As a board member he created its biomedical program and began training sixth graders about ten years ago. Some of them are now finishing college.
LIFT-VA opens that model to students across Virginia. Dr. C says the state has a science talent gap just as companies such as AstraZeneca, Eli Lilly, and Merck invest there. The program brings together Future Kings, GEMS (Genomic Education Mentors & Scientists), and Athari BioSciences, whose BSL-2, CLIA-certified lab in Sterling hosts training. Students also train in Prince William County. The program is funded by GO Virginia, and he says its first summer cohort trained 53 students.
There is a second track for instructors: people with master’s degrees or PhDs who teach while getting ready for industry jobs. In his experience, the best people on his teams are the ones who can explain things to their peers, and they often become the best managers. Kevin, whose own path ran from pre-med through academia, government, and industry, wants early-career scientists to see options they may not know about, including management, policy, and entrepreneurship.
Teamwork, capstones, and communicating science
Each eight-week program ends with a capstone. Teams of three to five get a condition, such as antimicrobial resistance or heart disease, and must propose a solution, present it, and defend it. Dr. C modeled the exercise on his companies, where young scientists pitch ideas and leaders decide whether to invest. It also teaches students to work with people who aren’t like them.
Kevin calls communication an undervalued skill that he didn’t build until he started giving conference talks and posters. Dr. C agrees that being able to communicate an idea matters as much as knowing how to do the work.
Staying above the AI layer
Dr. C calls AI a tool, and he is developing a three-credit course on applications of generative AI to biomedical drug discovery that he hopes to offer next year. He also puts AI in the same class as nuclear and genetic technology: powerful enough to make things better or to do great harm, and in need of careful regulation and guardrails.
With students he starts by asking what AI is, and then what intelligence is. In his view, AI tries to do what the brain does, only faster. It can’t supply creativity or what he calls a person’s is-ness, an idea he borrows from the comedy You, Me and Dupree: the mix of lived experience, everything other people have poured into you, and how you interpret the world. He uses all kinds of AI tools and enjoys the efficiency, but he doesn’t use AI to generate his ideas.
Looking five to ten years out, he expects AI to streamline drug discovery. He is designing a molecule that would normally need about three computational biologists, and he can do it because he knows which questions to ask. Kevin adds that those scientists can bring their own is-ness to the next problem. Dr. C’s advice to students is to be the creative force behind the work, not the part that can be replaced.
In their words
Transcript excerpts
Selected passages from the episode, with filler words removed and punctuation lightly normalized. Bracketed words are added for clarity. Timestamps mark where each passage begins.
On his grandmother’s lab
“I got to go there. That was my summer camp. My summer vacation was spent looking at tumor cells with my grandmother and learning how to do PCR from my grandmother.”
On representation
“That experience, like that identity, if you will, with the African American male scientist let me know this was something I could do. And that really sort of turbocharged my desire to do it more and then even guided my college selection.”
On the drug discovery funnel
“It’s like a funnel. You start out with thousands of opportunities and only one or two candidates actually advance into human studies. And then even half of those fail. So that’s why it takes so long and so much money to develop a drug.”
On basic research
“You need that strong academic science out there. You need those scientists that are studying Drosophila and other things. They’re trying to figure out mechanistically how things are working in an organism. That’s important. So that work, you need to keep funding.”
On communication
“That capability to communicate your science, your idea, is really, really just as important as learning how to do it.”
On using AI
“As a scientist, I use all kinds of AI tools and I’m actually enjoying using them because it’s making things more efficient for me. But I don’t use AI to generate my idea. That comes from deep within.”
On service
“As my great-grandmother and others used to say, service is the rent we pay for living. So we all owe it to our fellow citizens and society to give as much as we can to make this country and this world as good as we can make it.”
Keep exploring
Show notes & source links
People, organizations, programs, and further reading connected to the conversation. Each entry explains the connection. Links are references, not endorsements.
Dr. Cunningham & his companies
- Dr. Tshaka Cunningham · Polaris Genomics team ↗
His biography as co-founder and Director of Research & Development, including his Princeton, Rockefeller, Pasteur Institute, and VA background.
00:34 ↗ - Dr. Tshaka Cunningham · Athari BioSciences leadership ↗
His profile as Chief Scientific Officer, including his drug discovery work at Bristol Myers Squibb.
01:04 ↗ - Polaris Genomics ↗
The company developing molecular biomarkers for mental health that Dr. C describes in the behavioral health chapter.
41:56 ↗ - Athari BioSciences ↗
A BSL-2, CLIA-certified laboratory in Sterling, Virginia, where LIFT-VA students train.
47:41 ↗
LIFT-VA & workforce programs
- LIFT-VA ↗
Life-Sciences Innovation & Future Talent – Virginia, the workforce pathway for students, instructors, and employers discussed in the episode.
44:50 ↗ - About LIFT-VA and its partners ↗
How Future Kings, Athari BioSciences, and GEMS each contribute to the program.
47:27 ↗ - Future Kings ↗
The Northern Virginia STEM nonprofit where Dr. C serves on the board and created the biomedical program.
46:12 ↗ - GEMS · Genomic Education Mentors & Scientists ↗
The nonprofit arm of Athari BioSciences, focused on genomic literacy, mentorship, and workforce development.
47:33 ↗ - GO Virginia Region 7 funds LIFT-VA · VirginiaBio ↗
Background on the state grant behind LIFT-VA and the pharmaceutical investment driving demand for trained workers.
48:22 ↗
Institutions on his path
- National Cancer Institute ↗
Where Dr. C’s grandmother worked as a cancer researcher.
02:54 ↗ - Morehouse School of Medicine ↗
Home of the summer research program where he met a Black male PhD for the first time.
11:53 ↗ - Princeton University · Department of Molecular Biology ↗
The department that drew him to Princeton.
13:18 ↗ - Bristol Myers Squibb ↗
Where he learned drug discovery as an associate research scientist before graduate school.
24:37 ↗ - 125 years of ‘science for the benefit of humanity’ · Rockefeller University ↗
Rockefeller’s history and motto, which Dr. C cites. He earned his PhD there.
36:11 ↗ - Institut Pasteur ↗
The Paris research institute where he completed postdoctoral training.
31:13 ↗ - Drug Information Association (DIA) ↗
The global organization where he spent a year as director of scientific collaboration, learning regulatory affairs.
39:37 ↗
Scientists & history
- Katherine Johnson · NASA ↗
The NASA mathematician portrayed in Hidden Figures, the film Dr. C uses to describe his grandmother’s generation.
03:11 ↗ - Ernest Everett Just · Marine Biological Laboratory ↗
The MBL’s biography of the pioneering Black biologist whose name was on Dr. C’s Morehouse summer program.
12:03 ↗ - Black Apollo of Science · Oxford University Press ↗
Kenneth R. Manning’s biography of E. E. Just, which Dr. C recommends.
17:56 ↗ - Charles R. Drew · Profiles in Science, National Library of Medicine ↗
The surgeon and researcher who organized America’s first large-scale blood bank.
15:21 ↗ - Arnold J. Levine · AACR Academy ↗
The cancer biologist known for the 1979 discovery of p53, and Dr. C’s mentor at Princeton.
13:33 ↗ - Cato T. Laurencin · National Academy of Sciences ↗
The orthopaedic surgeon and regenerative engineering pioneer Dr. C shadowed as a Princeton senior.
22:19 ↗ - The Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2020 ↗
Awarded to Harvey J. Alter, Michael Houghton, and Charles M. Rice for the discovery of hepatitis C virus.
30:16 ↗ - Charles M. Rice honored with Nobel Prize · Rockefeller University ↗
Rockefeller’s account of the research by Dr. C’s thesis mentor that contributed to a cure for hepatitis C.
30:35 ↗ - Ho Lab · Aaron Diamond AIDS Research Center ↗
David Ho’s lab, which led the development and testing of combination antiretroviral therapy for HIV.
30:42 ↗ - Poliomyelitis fact sheet · World Health Organization ↗
Where global polio eradication stands, for context on the conversation about curing diseases.
35:11 ↗
Accuracy & context
Editorial notes
- Disclosure. Galang AI, which presents the show, is a LIFT-VA employer and industry partner working with Athari BioSciences. Read the announcement.
- Opinions, not advice. Dr. C’s views on AI, regulation, research funding, and politics are his own and do not represent Polaris Genomics, Athari BioSciences, LIFT-VA, or Galang AI. His descriptions of the Polaris Genomics test and how well it works are also his own. The test is in clinical study, and this page does not evaluate it. Nothing here is medical advice.
- Names and terminology. These notes use Tshaka Cunningham, LIFT-VA, Athari BioSciences, and Cato T. Laurencin where the automatic transcript contains phonetic spellings. At 14:50 Dr. C names his mentor from the Morehouse program. We could not confirm the spelling, so the name is left out here.
More context
- p53. Researchers first studied p53 as an oncogene after its discovery in 1979. Within a decade it was recognized as a tumor suppressor gene, one of the most frequently mutated genes in human cancer. Arnold Levine and Moshe Oren trace that history in The first 30 years of p53.
- E. E. Just. Ernest Everett Just was a professor at Howard University, where he headed the new zoology department, and spent more than 20 summers studying marine eggs at the Marine Biological Laboratory in Woods Hole. The MBL’s biography notes that although he was internationally respected, he could not find a position at any major institution because he was Black, so he continued his research in Europe.
- Charles Drew. Drew died on April 1, 1950, in Burlington, North Carolina, from injuries he sustained in a car accident on his way to a conference. The National Library of Medicine’s biography records that he received prompt and competent care from the white physicians at a nearby hospital but was too badly injured to survive.
- Polio. The World Health Organization reports that wild poliovirus cases have fallen by more than 99% since 1988, from an estimated 350,000 cases in more than 125 endemic countries. Endemic transmission continues in parts of Afghanistan and Pakistan. WHO describes the world as on the threshold of eradicating a human disease for only the second time, after smallpox in 1980.
Quick answers
About the episode & the show
- Who is Dr. Tshaka Cunningham?
- Dr. Tshaka Cunningham is a molecular biologist, biotech entrepreneur, and educator. He co-founded Polaris Genomics, where he is Director of Research & Development, and he is Chief Scientific Officer at Athari BioSciences. He studied molecular biology at Princeton, worked in drug discovery at Bristol Myers Squibb, and earned his PhD at Rockefeller University.
- What does Episode 3 cover?
- Episode 3 follows Dr. Cunningham’s path into science, from his grandmother’s cancer research lab and the mentors who showed him a scientific career to drug discovery at Bristol Myers Squibb and work in academia, government, and biotech. It also covers molecular diagnostics for behavioral health, workforce training through LIFT-VA, and how scientists should work with AI.
- What is LIFT-VA, and who runs it?
- LIFT-VA (Life-Sciences Innovation & Future Talent – Virginia) is a workforce pathway that takes students and emerging professionals from hands-on lab training toward life sciences careers. Three organizations run it together: Future Kings built the academic framework, GEMS delivers it through scientist mentors, and Athari BioSciences hosts training in its BSL-2, CLIA-certified lab in Sterling, Virginia.
- What does “stay above the AI layer” mean?
- It is Dr. Cunningham’s advice to scientists who use AI. He uses AI tools to work faster but keeps the original ideas his own. “Stay above the AI layer, be the creator, come up with the stuff,” he says at 1:01:58. He encourages students to be the driving creative force behind their work.
- How does Dr. Cunningham use AI in drug discovery?
- Dr. Cunningham says he uses AI tools for efficiency, not to generate his ideas. He is designing a molecule that would normally need about three computational biologists, and he can do it with AI because he knows which questions to ask. He is also developing a three-credit course on applications of generative AI to biomedical drug discovery.
- Who hosts Down To A Science?
- Kevin G. Libuit hosts Down To A Science, a podcast of conversations with practitioners in science, technology, and business about their work, personal insights, and real-world impact. A scientist by training, Kevin is Chief Operating Officer at Galang AI, which presents the show. He previously led technology and operations at Theiagen Genomics.
- Where can I watch or listen to Episode 3?
- Watch Episode 3 of Down To A Science on YouTube, or listen on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or Amazon Music. The episode runs 1 hour and 6 minutes. The platform links at the top of this page open the episode directly, and the Show Notes index collects the guide for every episode.